S1:E18 Staying Embodied As Women Despite Our Fears (with Cassandra Ciarallo)
SHOW NOTES
Have you found yourself stuck, or even paralyzed by your fears when attempting to achieve your dream life or relationship? Do you feel clueless about how to make progress when you can't seem to tolerate the discomfort of moving forward? Then you will definitely want to joining me for this juicy conversation with special guest, Cassandra Ciarallo!
Warmly,
Linda
We discuss:
Fears women hold about their unmet desires. How self worth impacts one’s ability to believe what is possible for us.
The disconnect between the body and the mind that can arise when our desires seem too enchanted or magical. Why Cassandra focuses so much on embodiment in order to help women move towards their enchantment
Fears of being seen that block us from being seen in the ways that are required to receive our desires.
The power of discerning the type of fear we have in our bodies, and knowing whether our body is telling us No or is it a fear of vulnerability.
And so much more!
Cassandra's Bio:
Enchantment Coach & Embodiment Facilitator, Cassandra helps women feel empowered to express their most present, embodied and authentic selves. She helps them reconnect to their bodies, reignite their passions and rewire their thoughts, feelings and energy.
Cassandra's website: https://www.coachingwithcass.com
Cassandra's LinkedIn
Cassandra's Instagram
💖 For comprehensive support from a licensed therapist, reach out to me through:
Meet Your Host!
Linda Sanderville, LCSW, RYT-200 is the founder of Satya Counseling & Yoga LLC. She specializes in concierge therapy for female founders and public figures, helping high-profile women navigate public scandal, executive burnout, and the values that will define the second half of life. Based in Albuquerque and serving clients virtually in DC, Maryland, Virginia, and beyond, Linda combines clinical expertise with somatic wisdom to help leaders reclaim their truth.
Read below for full transcript.
[00:00] — Intro & Guest Introduction
Hi, I'm Linda, a motion coach and hypnotherapist who also loves a good sunrise yoga class, listening to the belly laughs of my baby boys, and hunting down the best vegan donuts. This podcast is for ambitious and high-performing women who want to feel fulfilled in all areas of their life. I'm here to give you practical tips and mindset shifts that will help you put your self-love skills into action. Welcome.
Linda: Welcome back to the Self-Love Skills podcast. Today I am so pleased to be joined by Cassandra Ciarallo. She is my first guest on this podcast, which is very exciting. She has a lot to share about self-love and how it connects to so many of the decisions and fears that we hold as women. Cassandra is an enchantment coach and embodiment facilitator who focuses on helping women feel more empowered to express their most present, embodied, and authentic selves. She helps them reconnect with their bodies, reignite their passions, and rewire their thoughts, feelings, and energy. As an entrepreneur for almost a decade, she brings her experience as an agent of change to help others step into the life they have always dreamed of. She specializes in leading with the wisdom of the body from her somatic studies in the art of presence and soul-based healing with Tao Healing Hands. Cassandra, so excited to have you on today.
Cassandra: Oh, thank you so much, Linda. It's a pleasure.
Linda: It was such a pleasure meeting you. I know our listeners probably already know by now, but there's going to be a summit coming up in October — a special online event where a lot of us women are coming together to focus on helping women reclaim their joy through all facets of life: health, relationships, self-love, finances. In meeting you, I felt this really great synergy with what we both feel so strongly about when it comes to helping women feel free, embodied, and alive.
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[02:37] The Fears That Block an Enchanted Life
Linda: One thing I really wanted you to speak on is about the fears that women hold when it comes to having an enchanted life or enchanting themselves. I feel like this doesn't get discussed enough and it can create a self-sabotage pattern when it comes to showing up in life in this way or being seen in this way. If we don't understand it, we can't do anything about it. I'm curious what you've seen or experienced when it comes to those underlying fears we might not be completely aware of.
Cassandra: I love this question. I love to get to the root of it because this really is what blocks a lot of women from moving forward and the things they say they want in life. That's where our enchantment lies — when we can start to move towards the life we so desire in our hearts. The first thing that comes to mind, based on what enchantment means to me, is being able to transform fear into possibility, expansion, and a sense of wonder.
What I see a lot with women is this fear of actually declaring the things they want, because they're afraid that if they say it, they'll have to really move towards it — or they don't actually believe it's true. There's an underlying fear of "I can't have that" or "I'm not worthy of it." There's a lot of self-worth in that, and it blocks them from even stepping into that possibility.
Linda: I want to grab that — the self-worth piece. So there's the fear of "could that even happen for me?" But underneath that, it's the beliefs you hold about yourself getting in the way of what you desire.
Cassandra: Totally. Not even being able to have it as a tangible thing. It's almost too enchanted, too magical — it's not something that can actually be believable. And it's funny, I was speaking to a client yesterday where I caught her saying certain things and I'm like, "You don't even believe that's true, do you?" It's so interesting — the things we say we want, and yet there's literally such a disconnect from the body. It's so up here in the mind that there's no embodiment, and so it can't manifest in our lives.
That's the next step — embodiment. A lot of what's happening gets stuck in reliving the past or worrying about the future, these loops we're constantly in. So there's the believability part and the worthiness, but then the embodiment piece is also like, "If I'm saying I want this enchanted life, I need to put myself out there, step towards it, be seen." And there's a lot of fear around being seen.
Linda: Yes. And I think that fear goes more with the embodiment piece, because as we continue to step towards the things we say we want, we need to do that through the experience of our lives, which is an embodied state. You're going to be very much seen if you're moving towards the things you say you want in this lifetime.
Cassandra: I know these are all things I've also struggled with myself, and I see it again and again with my clients. Being seen is scary for a lot of women, including myself. But I spoke about this on my Instagram this week — discerning the type of fear in our bodies. Because fear can be our friend. It's really about befriending fear and moving towards the fear or moving with the fear. Is the fear just that you're afraid to step into the vulnerability of being seen? Or is it telling you it's a no? There's a difference in the discernment of what's arising inside of you. That's another layer — is this a yes or a no to move towards?
Linda: Yes, I love it. I want to highlight what you said about fears of being seen blocking us from the visibility that's actually required if we want to realize and receive some of those goals. For me, this was certainly true with romantic desires — desires for intimate connection. There were multiple reasons why I felt fear in my body around really connecting on that level and embracing that vulnerability. At the same time, I desired that connection, I desired that life partner. And so I really had to work through those layers of being seen in that way so intimately in order to finally connect with the person who was my person. But it took years. And frankly, I think if I had known more about subconscious work earlier in life, it probably wouldn't have needed to take years — but I'm also grateful for the journey. You do have to at some point make peace with allowing yourself to be seen.
Cassandra: I love that you gave the example of relationship. And I'll speak to maybe women who want to move towards their dreams of running their own business or being entrepreneurs or whatever career they've desired. Last week I did a corporate event, and I was so nervous. There was so much fear arising before I did it. Everything leading up to it — fear, anxiety — until I got to the moment of doing it where it just felt like, "Wow, okay, this feels so right." But had I let the fear and anxiety take over, I could have found a million and one excuses to drop the ball or not actually move towards it, because it meant I was going to be seen. It meant stepping up in a bigger way in my career.
Linda: So what I heard you say is: you embrace fear. Even though you're feeling all this vulnerability and discomfort, you keep moving towards it. And then you were able to find partnership. And I know now you have a beautiful family. So it's about moving with the discomfort or moving through it.
Cassandra: That's another fear: women are afraid to be with the discomfort, because it's almost too painful sometimes to sit with. To say, "Oh my goodness, this is here, and I don't know how to move forward with it. I don't know how to be okay with just feeling this." I'm used to numbing or running from it. And that was me for a long time - chasing the feel-good feeling. But that's not self-love. That's the opposite. That's total disconnection. Total self-abandonment. And the more that we self-abandon instead of self-love - to stay with all of the things that are there - we're going to keep seeing that in our work and our external life. If we can't be present with what's occurring inside of us, how are we going to find partners that aren't going to abandon us? How are we going to find relationships with friends or career opportunities that aren't just going to abandon us if we can't even be with ourselves? Self-love over self-abandonment.
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[14:22] Sitting with Discomfort & the Power of Subconscious Work
Linda: You know, I'm taking so many notes as you're talking because it's just so good. I encourage listeners, if you're not driving, to take some notes for yourself.
It's so tricky when it comes to self-abandonment because it's such a trigger response, such an automated response in our system when we haven't learned to recognize the difference between a "no, never" and a "no, not right now" and "oh, I just have some unresolved fears about this thing that I haven't addressed yet." Once we address those fears, then I will feel comfortable moving forward.
I think the example you used of that corporate experience (I went through my own hypnosis work around why I had fears related to being successful). It just seemed silly - I want to be successful, there's lots of reasons for it. I want to receive good for myself, do good for my family, do good for lots of other people. So why would I be afraid of being successful?
And it wasn't until I addressed and really went in on where that discomfort was coming from in my body, where it was coming from in my past, what the beliefs were, that I uncovered that one of the big pieces was around a fear of a loved one being resentful of me or having hatred towards me if I had further success. I had never been able to pinpoint it. But then, all of a sudden, sitting with that discomfort, like you're talking about, that we can't just keep running away from bad feelings, that's not self-love. Sitting with that discomfort is what enabled me to go all the way there. Because it was deep. It was way in the past. And it was hard. But once it was identified and I did that subconscious work, it actually resolved really quickly.
Quick Announcement from Linda: Self-love beauties, I have a special announcement to make. I have an event coming up this October, the 2nd through the 27th. It's called the Joy Reclaimed Summit. It is a gathering for women just like you who are looking to experience breakthroughs with physical health, emotional health, relational health — what have you. I've handpicked 25 exceptional women to speak directly to you and share their stories of how they've achieved their own breakthroughs and been able to reclaim their joy. Definitely come be a part of this gathering. You can find it at joyreclaimedsummit.com. And the information will also be in the show notes. And a bonus — there's going to be giveaways each week. If you join in with the Facebook group for the event, you will have opportunities to win some really nice prizes, including some one-on-one sessions with myself and some of my other speaker coaches. And that will help you get to your breakthrough even faster. All right, so I look forward to seeing you there.
Cassandra: There is so much power in what you're saying - to be able to find a way to sit with it in a way that doesn't just harm ourselves. We're not trying to encourage people to emotionally harm themselves, but we don't want them to miss out either. I love that example you gave. And it's so powerful - the more we practice being with it, how quickly it can resolve and how quickly it can be transformed.
I had a similar experience recently. I was speaking to a friend about it the other day — this is the journey of entrepreneurship where there's so many ups and downs. I was really sitting in confusion, this kind of familiar feeling that I don't think I would have gone as deep into as I did this time. And just being with it and witnessing it and acknowledging it and crying about it — oh my God, I felt like a new person the next morning.
And it was just so interesting to be like, "I've been here so many times before, and I've never moved through it this quickly." Because I think I would always be clinging to needing to know the answers. And I just said, "Oh, I'm just going to be with you, confusion. I'm just going to sit with you. I'm just going to allow to not know. I don't know all the answers right now. I don't always have the clarity of my path. But all I know is I'm going to keep showing up, and the path is going to continue to unfold." And that wisdom became so clear when I leaned into the feeling. It was just this really empowering place that I was able to come to.
Linda: And that's the beauty of it — when we lean into it, it transforms. There's so much insight, just like the insight you received. And we get more information when we lean into it versus numbing it, running, wanting to feel better — so grabbing the drink or grabbing whatever it is that we do to distract.
Cassandra: And I'm human — I grab my phone at times, and I grab the things. But I think there's always an opportunity to just say, "Hey, I see you, I feel you, I'm here with you." And being with that allows for it to — it's just so interesting that it's a practice and a muscle to build. And the more that we build that muscle, that's the self-love. That's the opportunity there for that depth of connection with who we are. And for more of what we really want in this life to keep unfolding, and the answers to keep showing up, the more that we go towards it.
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[21:28] Action as the Clarity Engine & the Manifestation Equation
Linda: You mentioned this idea of continuing to take the next step on the path, even when you don't have all the clarity about where it's going to lead. And that's huge, right? Because what you highlighted earlier about how, as women, we can really be afraid of stepping into possibility — imagining the best-case scenario creates fear because "what if it doesn't happen?" Or "maybe it can, but I don't even know what the steps are between where I am today and how to get to that place I want to be tomorrow." There's so much that's scary there when you're doing it, especially for the first time — or really even the twentieth time.
Cassandra: What's interesting is that this popped into my mind — I watched a reel on Instagram this morning about, "Well, what if it's actually better than you could have ever imagined?" And what if we can't know the end because the end is actually something so much better than we possibly perceive for ourselves right now? And that is enchantment, right? When we can lean into the mystery of life and surrender to not knowing and just stay committed to what we feel in our hearts. I'm committed to showing up, and I'm committed to every day holding my desires in my heart and taking action from that place.
And that's all I can know. I don't know what's going to happen in six months or a year, but I can trust that if I'm showing up from this place, things will continue to unfold for me in the highest good. And that can also be really exciting. When we can step into the place of holding that desire versus falling into fear — fear can come with us, but not letting it take over and hijack and be the driver — then there's so much there for us to receive. I truly feel that.
Linda: The way you're phrasing it immediately made me think about being in that childlike mindset — they would call it beginner's mind. Just allowing, just allowing, just allowing. Just not exerting so much control over the process or the outcome. And just exploring, being curious about what is, and having fun with it. It's such a playful energy to be there and to let yourself receive. That's enchanting, isn't it? The more you talk, the more I'm like, "Ah" - is what enchantment means. That magic. The delight and the wonder of "I wonder what it can be like" versus the "I don't know what it's like" from a fear-based place. Or the assumptive mind already making a conclusion about what it's going to be like. How can you stay in the wonder and surrender everything you know?
Cassandra: It feels expansive, doesn't it?
Linda: It does. And it kind of goes back to what you were saying before — "Is it too enchanted? Is it too magical?" I wonder how we make this grabbable. How can someone pick this up and start messing with it with their hands and feel like they can approach this idea of coming into more of an enchanted life? Where would someone who was a beginner start?
Cassandra: That's a great question. I would encourage that the grounded part is the embodiment piece. So it's not just "I wonder, I wonder" — there's a sense that we need to expand the mind, that's the mind piece. However, can you feel that in your body as well? I call this the creation ritual — where you can spend a few minutes in your morning actually feeling what you want and being in a space where you can just allow yourself to embody that desire. And then the tangible piece is, "I'm not just going to sit here every day and meditate, but I'm going to take the steps to move towards it."
That's the action and grounded piece. We're not just being in magic all day and woo-woo — we need to take necessary steps towards the things we say we want. Otherwise, you are just in this fantasy world where nothing is actually tangible in this lifetime for you. So the feeling part, the mind part of "I wonder" — letting yourself dream about it, letting yourself feel about it — and then, "What is the one thing I can do today to move me closer to this desire?" And actually taking action on it.
Linda: Yes. And that's where I help people — working with the body, aligning everything so that we're moving through the fears, but we're really getting clear on what the heart's desire is. Not from what I'm afraid of or what I feel like I should do because of all the people outside of me — but what do you really want? And then how can I help you take the steps in creating that in your life? Making it real.
Cassandra: Making it really real. Taking action. Not just staying in the fantasy. And having some support, because I think it is a scary process to move towards our deepest dreams and desires. Actually, as I'm saying this now, there's another fear that's popping in — when I think about the beginning of my journey a year and a half ago, there was imposter syndrome like crazy. And I hear that from a lot of people just starting new journeys. Who am I? What are people going to think of me? How am I really going to help people?
But the action piece is what gives us clarity. Because I have conversations with one person and then I have a coaching session with somebody else, and it builds belief. I'm like, "Oh, I actually am helping people. Oh, people are validating me and saying that I'm good at this. Okay, so I continue to build belief." So the important part here is action, because action gives us clarity on what we want and what we don't want, and it continues to build belief for ourselves. We get feedback from life every time we move forward. We don't get any feedback the more we just stay in our head about it.
Linda: I think a lot of people think a lot of things and then don't take action. And then they stay in these desires for a long time that either never come true or… I guess it's like a form of staying stuck. Analysis paralysis, where you're just thinking about the worst-case scenario and letting fear take over and then playing small. It's easier to just stay in that comfort zone of "I'm going to have all these ideas within me, but I'm never going to move towards them and take action."
Talk is cheap if you don't take action. I think all of us can identify somebody in our lives that we know says a lot of things that they want but never really shows up in the action piece. Enchantment is about moving you towards your deepest desires and letting them manifest in your life. The way you're putting this offers so much clarity, because I think the buzzword of "manifestation" has really created a lot of confusion over the last five to ten years. It seems like it's all woo; all staying in the feeling and experiencing it and fantasizing about it.
And you're saying, "Okay, talk is cheap. We use the feeling to fuel us into a place that's courageous, that's brave. Again, at our own pace, because everyone's pace is different. But that enables you to then take that next step on the path so that you can actually experience this thing for real."
Cassandra: I got chills in my body. It's so true, because the two need to go together to be the perfect equation. And what you said there was so important - the feeling fuels us. The desire is such an important piece. That's why it's important to do the little rituals in the morning and do the feeling part, because the feeling is what actually ignites the energy and the life force within us. Without that, the action piece is just flat. There's no energy to even move, to even take the action.
So that part is really important for fueling us and knowing, "What is even lighting me up right now?" And that's the signal that we're giving out to life. It's an important piece of the manifestation part. But we get so much more information when we actually take the action. And the action doesn't need to be a crazy big action. It can be one little tiny step.
Maybe it's making one phone call to a friend to get more information about something. Maybe it's making a post on social media. Maybe it's doing research. It doesn't need to be this big thing. But it's setting some time aside to line up the action piece towards that dream and desire. And then taking that will again give you feedback and information. "How does this feel? Taking this action, how does this feel?"
You're checking in with the feelings and the desire all along the way to see, "Does this line up?" Because I also know people who have the feelings, start to take action, and they're like, "Oh, this actually isn't what I want. I thought this is what I wanted, then I took action and it was very clear that this isn't the path for me." So great. Now there's clarity that that isn't actually what you want. And there's potentially something else for you that needs to be desired. The action piece helps to clarify everything.
Linda: And I think the way that you just described that also can give a lot more of a gentle perspective on "failing fast" and "failing forward." And of course, not everyone loves the word "failing." But I'm just thinking about it in terms of making it a little bit less of a scary word. If you didn't take the action, you wouldn't know — "Oh wait, I don't like this. This doesn't feel good. I don't feel good with this person. I don't want to move forward with that."
But the faster you can figure that out, the more time and energy you save yourself actually in the long run. Because then you are even more able to align towards what is actually a perfect fit for you.
Cassandra: Yes. Because you tried it and you're like, "Okay, I'm good. I'm moving on from this. It's okay. It's not for me."
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[36:31] Giving Yourself Permission
Linda: What a fun conversation. And we already knew before we started that we had to be careful not to be here all day, talking about these things for hours between the two of us. So, lastly, if you can just encourage our listeners around this idea of women really often needing permission to seek what they desire or to embrace what they desire. You and I both work with women who are very high-performing, high-achieving, ambitious. And sometimes even as they are achieving so much and performing so well, kind of like on a public stage, there are things, needs, desires going on on the inside.
And there may be a lot of guilt, imposter syndrome, whatever it is that blocks them from really embracing their desires wholeheartedly, or embracing opportunities to put themselves first. So I'm curious what you would offer to someone listening who feels like they perform well on the outside but they are engaging in some self-neglect internally.
Cassandra: That's a really good question. I think what comes up for me first is, what does giving yourself permission look like? Because I think - and I know for myself - that the tendency or this idea of needing permission comes from the outside. It's this validation we need from somebody else or something to be like, "Okay, I can do this now because this person just told me it's okay." And that's okay.
I think at times it's supportive for us on the journey. But it's important to notice when you are seeking that, and then asking yourself, "What would it look like for me to give myself permission?" For myself, I started to get curious about what that might look like. And I started to really notice when I was needing permission from my coach or needing permission from my family. And it was in the beginning, even saying things to my coach like, "I'm really noticing that I want your validation on this. But I'm going to speak up about it and share that I'm catching myself in this. But I do still want your advice here."
So it's okay to do that. But just speaking that out gives yourself permission to be like, "It's okay to still seek support." And then there's a nuance. When are you really needing somebody else to give you that permission, versus when you can just say, "Hey, I do need support right now, and that's okay too"? But always going inside and saying, "What do I need right now? And what would giving myself permission look like, not from the outside world, but just for myself?"
For me, that's been asking myself, "What if I did lean into this that feels scary for me — just do it on my own versus have somebody validating me from the outside?" And it feels risky. It can sometimes feel really risky. But when we can lean into that, there's so much empowerment that can arise from that place. When we can just start to give ourselves that self-love of, "Hey, I can do this on my own. Hey, I can be there for myself." And I can also share when I'm feeling vulnerable.
And when I might be like, "Hey, I feel like I need your validation, but I'm just going to ask this anyway and see what you think." And then knowing that the outside world might not give you the permission that you want all the time either. And then that's validating for you as well. Sometimes we ask the outside world so that we get more clarity of what we really want for ourselves and the permission we need to give to ourselves.
There's no linear path here. It's all very nuanced. And I think what's important is that there's a check-in with the body and the experience internally. As long as you're clear on that, be free to have permission to just practice expressing yourself. And that part alone will give you freedom, will give you empowerment. It's a really deep place of self-love.
Linda: Thank you. Thank you for that.
Cassandra: My pleasure. I know we could talk for literal hours.
Linda: I know, I know. But I think that's a great place to end. Please consider for yourself, dear lovely listener, if there's a way that you can check in and evaluate where and when you were seeking that permission and that validation. Practice naming it out loud, just owning, "That's what's going on." And evaluating the information that you get back from that outside source and seeing, "Does it even line up with what I think and feel on the inside?" Just like Cassandra was saying, it might give you feedback. And sometimes I know for me, there's been occasions where that feedback is, "Okay, I didn't get the validation. But I know this thing so deeply in me; I haven't wavered yet, even without that outside validation. So I know I need to just proceed anyway." And sometimes that's the clarity that you get from pausing and evaluating that information.
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[43:26] Closing, Resources & Where to Find Cassandra
Linda: Cassandra, gosh, thank you. Thank you. Where can folks find you online if they're resonating with what you're saying and want to know more about you?
Cassandra: I am coaching with Cass pretty much everywhere online. I show up a lot on Instagram, so you can follow me at @coachingwithcass. My website is coachingwithcass.com. And on the website, you can see I host free monthly webinars where you can come and have an experience with me, and I teach quite a tangible, valuable practice that you can leave with every time to support you on your embodiment journey or enchantment journey - and really connecting deeper with the things you want in this life. It's always a great opportunity for sharing and experiencing together, maybe getting a little one-on-one coaching. I really love for it to be like an open circle kind of experience where lots of people share. So if that resonates with you, come join and we'd love to meet you. And thank you for tuning in. So grateful.
Thank you so much, Linda, for having me. I really loved this entire conversation.
Linda: My pleasure, absolutely. Well, be sure to go follow Cassandra and learn more about her if this is resonating for you. And do tune in next time for the Self-Love Skills podcast. Oh, and of course, Cassandra is going to be one of the speakers on the Joy Reclaimed Summit, so I'm so excited about that. And it's definitely just another reason to make sure you sign up for the summit.
Cassandra: Yes, the Joy Reclaimed Summit. It's all there for you.
Linda: Thank you, thank you, Cassandra. So enjoy the rest of your day up there in Toronto. And I'm sure we will connect again.
Cassandra: Yes. Blessings. Bye.
Linda: You hung with me to the end, my shero. If you benefited from this episode, please say thanks by leaving a wonderful review. It helps me know what's helping you the most and allows more like-minded women to find and learn from this podcast. We don't want to keep all the good stuff for ourselves. See you next time.
[Editing Note: The Love Yourself Liberated! group program is not currently available. If you are interested in this content and guidance, it is now exclusively provided through my concierge psychotherapy practice, Satya Counseling & Yoga.]
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